Ever closer . . . .

[Jesters-Ink]

BH,

The profile you pasted there is from a book called----- >
“Luftwaffe Fighter Aircraft in profile”.
Or “Deutsche Jagdflugzeuge 1939-1945 in Farbprofilen” same book.
Yeah seen it many times, truth is even "the master" can be fed BS, here is his updated drawing of Green 1.

My reason for a repost is due to new info nothing is cast in stone til I think its done.
Funny thing is, I based my first attempt on that top pic you have posted there and how can I say this, its not a very good profile . . . . .

The debate over green one/red one will go on especially seeing as first publications of Grafs AC show it as being Red one and the only available photographs are in B/W.
The tipping of the scales in favour of green one, is the fact that Grafs AC were staff’s, so they should have been green numerals.

Now the other debate over the tail is due to photographs showing Graf standing next to the tail of his “other” AC, which was painted overall white.
No photographs of his tulip nose show it with a white tail as of yet.

I find it fascinating and think others would to, so I will post new info as and when.
Yes we went through this before and no need to swear, we will go through it again until the job is done

It also shows a healthy progression in work, something I think is very relevant to the people on simmers asking about where/how do you start.

Soooooo watch this space


“It's pretty easy to surmise that information on the color of the fuselage number must have come up in the preparations for the book”.

So it must, but he got it wrong at least once, 2 books, 2 colours

[BLOWHARD]

The profile you pasted there is from a book called

Where do ya think I got it from?

But enlighten me, where does white 10 fit in? It's different plane?

[Graf]

Ever closer eh? Sure wish I knew when I'd get close to finishing one.

[BLOWHARD]

OH, Graf is here, he flew the plane! Lets ask him! What about it Graf?

...wait, are you the REAL Graf or not?

[Jesters-Ink]

Like I said in onther post, no good asking the pilot lol.
White 10 is Alfred Grislawski's AC, Grafs wingman. . . . . . . enlightened?

[CRIPES_A_MIGHTY]

Hi ALL,

Well...seems to of stired up a hornets nest..LOL.

I agree, you cannot always trust what you read....but Im sure those who write these books do do some kind of research..it cant all be.."i dont know so ill say that..that will do".
Im no expert..so i have to beleive most of what i read..otherwise.

So, ok a couple of points.
JG27 DID use 109G's in 42..late though..so im convinced Jester's 109 is JG27 not JG77..dispite what ive read here..(all entitled to our opinions).
See..JG27 losses here. Missing In Action - JG 27
There are 3 noted losses of 109G-2's in 42.
Also on the wikipedia..there is a photo of a 109G-2 at a museum marked the same as Jester 109..it says its Gustav Rodel markings.
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...R%C3%B6del.JPG.
No matter how much you look for information, its maybe not always the best way to go,you can over do it, when simple is sometimes the best.

But I'll have to admite..I am a stickler for accuracy..I like my information as accuarte as possible...But sometime the answer is in your face and you cant see it for all the other information thrown at you.(IMH


As regards the 109s in the picture im after..thanks for the interest BLOWHARD.

Me109G-10 (WNr.490180 Yellow 14 piloted by Fw. Fritz Koal of II./JG27)
Me109G-14 (WNr.785756 Yellow 9 piloted by Fw. Karl-Heinz Schroder of II./JG27)

I have been incontact with the artist and here is the reply.

Quote:" consulted with Gehard Stemmer and other 109 historians on the colour Scheme for my painting The Bf 109s in my painting are the G-14AS and the G-10. The G-10s were all made from G-6 and G-14 airframes as an interim aircraft until the Bf 109Ks arrived. By December of 1944 109 units were flying a mixed bag of aircraft in both the grey scheme and the later brown and green scheme. So it is possible that they would have had either the RLM 74/75.76 scheme or the RLM 81/82/74 scheme or a combination depending on paint supplies at the unit level. I chose to depict them in late afternoon or early morning yellow light which would have warmed up the grey and green colours. This makes the colour scheme ambiguous. Which ever scheme you chose will be correct."

Follow Up. Quote:" Looking at my painting again and trying to recall my thinking at the time, I think that the G-14 has at the very least a green and brown tail assembly with a tall tail wheel. Possibly a retrofit after combat damage. The G-10 looks more like it has the two tone grey camo.

So whats the thinking?
Incase you missed the it, these are the last 2, 109's shot down by top Mustang Ace Major.George Preddy on the day of his untimely death. Major. Preddy took on both aircraft, and it a turning dogfight with "Yellow 14", "Yellow 9" crossed his path. With a quick burst, Preddy hit the aircraft and the pilot bailed out. He then gained on "Yellow 14" and again with a quick burst, he hit the aircarft and the pilot bailed out.
Both pilots survived, though Fritz Koal suffered eye injury from engine glyco on bailing out.

In a letter to the artist from Fritz Koal,

Quote:"I feel sorry that Major G.E.Preddy died when shot down by friendly fire. This is a sad ending for an ace, but was not so uncommon as some people think. I recall these accidents in the Luftwaffe as well. When thinking back I have to feel thankful for Preddy scoring the victory in our encounter. I got out of the war for a while and survived. Who knows whether I would have survived without this break".

Can't get better info than that!..LOL..Nice!

Now if I could just ID the FW-190 he was chasing before he was shot down...FAT CHANCE!..LOL

[Jesters-Ink]

I can see me taking these on

[Jesters-Ink]

A "new" 109 . . . G-4.

[Clave]

Nice, but complicated thread going on...

Is the last one 'gigi tre osei' Italian squadron?

[Otterkins2]

After close examination of photos of both of Graf's machines as done by Jester, the photos I have led me to these conclusions. The 1 has to be green because it is a staff aircraft. Jerry crandal, Claus Sundin and another French historian claim that even the scallops are green! That can't be so as a simple experiment proved. I took a shot of the model I built from the same angle as the one in the original photo and then desaturated it in Photoshop. The pictures are nearly identical. Therefor, Jester's renditions are essentially correct except for minor details which I won't nit pick over.